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Mythosaur
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I have recently felt, and been told by many of you, that you feel as though you are not being valued as members of the raid team for a variety of reasons just as diverse as the guild itself.

 

I thought I would create this topic so that you can make yourself heard, I will reply to each of you in turn, and would like to state there will be no backlash for anything said by anyone in this thread. (None the less stay away from unfounded personal attacks.)

 

So the long of it is, what are your attitudes towards raiding right now? How can we improve the raid environment? What would you like to see change? What would you like commended people for doing a great job at? IN addition feel free to add anything you find relevant.

 

I look forward to the discussion in this thread.

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I really liked that last week the raid was asked what we wanted to do and went with the majority, even if it was too late. We need to do that more often instead of just being told why what we're doing is best for the raid. Let the raid decide what's best. That way, everyone feels like they mattered, even if their answer wasn't the majority.

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I really liked that last week the raid was asked what we wanted to do and went with the majority, even if it was too late. We need to do that more often instead of just being told why what we're doing is best for the raid. Let the raid decide what's best. That way, everyone feels like they mattered, even if their answer wasn't the majority.

I think you raise a great point and one the officers have been discussing. In my opinion we should be going by what the guild wants to do most. (sans trolling) People want to down gruul and orgy gorger before H&F flamer and kromag? Why not. Perhaps a poll for people to vote on their preference is something we should set up.

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The officers really do have the best intentions for the raid group in mind at all times and we do what we think is best for the raid group.  Sometimes, we're just plain wrong with our assessment.  We will do polling occasionally but we really want you guys to just speak your mind and let us know as well.

 

Everybody definitely seemed happy with our vote last week ansky and it's something that we want to do more of in the future, but it's not going to be like that every raid day.  There's definitely a limit as to how much we can vote on and still be efficient.  Just imagine if everybody in the U.S. voted on every bill that went through our government - We would never have time to do anything else.  That's what we have our elected leaders for.  We also have to keep in mind that our officers have to be impartial and do what they think is best for the raid group as a whole instead of what's best for an individual.  Highmaul Mythic has a lot of items which are poorly itemized for many classes but there are still many huge upgrades in there for certain raiders which is why we started there last week.  If we would have put it to a vote immediately, half the raid would have voted no because they were the half who didn't have upgrades in Highmaul.  Just because something isn't good for one person doesn't mean it's not good for everyone.  We have to act as a team and do what's best for the team.


Edit:  By the way, there are no more plans for us to go back to Highmaul now with the ilvl upgrade in BRF unless we hit some kind of unanticipated wall in progression.

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I think voting for which wing to do next is in no way comparable to attempting to pass legislation. If people want to vote which bosses we do next I welcome it. Just need people to speak up with more suggestions, there are no bad ideas guys.

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We discuss ahead of time what our upcoming plans are for raid progression and where we are targeting next.  It's never a quick discussion and there's usually 2-4 of us actively discussing it.  To expand that discussion to 25 people would certainly be a large waste of time at best.  We only have so much time during our normal raiding hours.

 

We could do it on the forums ahead of time with all members but then people will just complain that people who have time to talk on the forums all day have their opinion valued more than those who can't.

 

Do you really want us to vote where to go next after every boss or even every wing?

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Think the length of the vote is equal to the timeout of a ready check...

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I am for voting at the end of the wing, like mastric said, it takes the timeout for a ready check.

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I don't think a "vote" is needed everytime you kill a farm content boss, you can simply ask in TS/raid chat when you're done with a wing and ask where people. I can see a vote being cast when you have multiple progression bosses to choose from, but that doesn't seem to be the case for now.

 

I'm glad to see such a thread have been made, recently the guild seemed to be crumbling (or at the very least bumping on a few obstacles), even from afar, and I must say it's a sad thing considering how awesome ATR can be. I definitely hope that'll help improve the raiding experience for everyone, and wish you best of luck for tonight's raid.

 

P-S: Mort's with you (in thoughts).

P-P-S: I expect a Maidens kill picture soon!

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I think it's very obvious when people in the raid are discontent, at least to me since people are quite vocal through TS and raid chat and just get blown off. Putting up a vote on order of killing farm bosses is silly. But going to a completely different raid? Skipping farm gear for progression? Then the raid needs to be involved.

 

Sometimes, when just one or two pople speak up and get immediately shut down, it doesn't mean the problem is fixed. It means that the other people who agree  won't see the point in speaking up. Taking a vote when there is a disagreement between the officer's plans and the raiders fixes that. It's never just one person.

Edited by Ansky
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These are all very good points Ansky.  I agree with you and apologize if I was dismissive in the past.  I'm not going to make any excuses...  We as an officer crew just need to do better, especially at everything you mentioned.

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